Podcast #2 – Phil Lenz & Ken Kirkland
We dive into the brains of Phil Lenz and Ken Kirkland.. it’s all about dat bass!
Pro Tip #28: Ramblings from 3 years – The negotiation
by Jason Harlow
Over 3 years ago, something magical happened in the Wiregrass. Musicians of the Wiregrass area gathered at a small upstairs location in Ozark, Al (now known as the VIP room at Live at Harlow’s). It was an invite only party which offered free beer and beverages, a full stage with gear, and nothing in the way of doing what we musicians do… rock face.
The events featured at least 3 bands, but I recall we often had more, up to 6 or maybe 7. It ultimately provided fellowship, networking, the realization as musicians that we’re more alike than we think, and the most fun to be had in the area (it was really fun).
Anyway, I was proud to be a part of those events and whether or not known at the time, it filled a void for me personally and provided some much needed purpose. Those events are what ultimately set the course for what is known as Live at Harlow’s today and the very same rules still apply, 1. have fun, 2. melt face.
Fast forward 3 years… we’ve seen well over 100 performances and had the opportunity to meet some great people, artists, and bands. The mission and purpose still remains intact to provide local musicians and artists with a location to network, showcase, jam, and enjoy creating great memories.
This pro tip is about things I’ve seen or heard in those 3 plus years and sharing some ideas which might assist in your journey. One caveat: These opinions are mine and you may disagree with is certainly cool. I’ve tried to share them from both a venue owner standpoint as well as a musician standpoint given I’ve been fortunate to experience both.
- Part 1: The negotiation / getting booked
From day one of opening the doors, I realized the position of venue owner / operator required me looking from a different lens. I was no longer the guy on the other end trying to get booked at the location, I was the guy trying to figure out the logistics and feasibility to getting the band on stage. This required looking at things like keeping the lights on, insurance, safety, licenses, staff, budget…etc. I realized that it’s not cheap and wondered how venues could even stay open frankly. The very first thing I did prior to opening a venue was to call on other venues. I remember distinctly a local venue in the area who supports musicians tell me not to do it or only do it if you are willing to lose money. They proceed to tell me they have not paid themselves for 5 years… and after 3 years, I see why! But this is not about that and I’m just making the statement to share that venues are not the profit centers I once thought of as a young musician. I’m now able to see with metrics both sides of the equation and want to simply share some of my journey and thoughts.
Over these 3 plus years, one thing continues to be both fun and sometimes frustrating. “The negotiation” as I like to call it. I can say I’ve seen a myriad of negotiation styles for booking and I’ve experienced some interesting pitches from bands /artists. For some, the negotiation of getting booked seems like pulling teeth. For some, they don’t even understand it is a negotiation and make ridiculous demands. For others, they just want to be a part of what is happening which is cool.
My intent here is not to make a guide to booking or negotiation but to share some quick tips to consider from a venue perspective and to hopefully lead to a better success in your booking and relationships with venues. Let’s get started with some quick tips!
Quick Tip 1: Research the venue. Go online and look at pictures, read about it, find out what makes them tick prior to contact.
Quick Tip 2: Visit the venue you want to play. This will pay dividends in your discussion.
Sure, there are more things you can do prior to contacting the venue to be booked but failure to do at least one of those can really set the tone negatively in your approach.
All that being said, if I were to summarize my experience, it seems like there are 2 primary categories of band negotiation styles:
Band 1: All about the money
Band 2: All about the opportunity
Both are important to success and I’m not saying one or the other is not needed…but… it’s my personal opinion that the order in which you get to them is most important.
Example dialog to make a point:
Band 1 (All about the money): “Hey, my band wants to play there. We’re real good and we know our value. How many people do you have at the venue? For us to play there, we need XXXXX money”
Band 2 (All about the opportunity): “Good afternoon, we absolutely love your venue. I was there last weekend to see “Phil Lenz and the Road Warriors”, man they rocked and the sound was amazing. I think our band would be a great fit for your venue. You can check out videos of us here. We would love to see if it’s feasible to see if we can play at your venue. Thanks for your time!”
Put yourself in the venues shoes now for a moment. Let’s analyze the opportunities missed or perceptions which could arise:
Band 1: “Hey, my band wants to play there”
Pending who you are talking to at the venue, just the word “Hey” in this example could be seen as disrespectful followed by “my band wants to play there” doesn’t really make the venue want to “learn more”. The fact they even use “there” is a lack of addressing where they want to play.
We’re real good and we know our value.
As a venue owner, I don’t think I’ve ever heard someone say “we suck” so just saying you are good does not necessarily add to the conversation rather opens the door to venues getting an impression of arrogance. As for the value statement, it’s important for a band to have standards but the timing of it probably isn’t good in the first paragraph of contact.
How many people do you have at the venue?
Something like this usually confirms the initial perception, this band has not even taken the time to research where they want to play. Obviously, their time is more important than the venue staff. Furthermore, venues may simply trash this because the band is now taking their time to try and explain what could have been easily discovered.
For us to play there, we need XXXXX money.
Eventually, the communication should lead to reimbursement of services. However, knowing the venues capabilities, number of patrons, and other income streams is a big factor in how many X’s should be in the statement. Does the venue promote, provide production, have built in crowds? Point on this is, be cautious on your approach, work to make something mutually beneficial if possible so the conversation doesn’t end immediately. Case and point, if someone comes to me and says “We get $2,500 a night”, as much as I would love to make it happen, it’s just not feasible with our size. The conversation just ends and opportunity which could pay other dividends ceases. Additionally, venues talk with each other and know what to expect from bands and their ability to bring patrons so it can feel a bit insulting if you are pushing for way more than the area allows or what you make at other places of similar size / capacity.
Now let’s do a deep dive on band 2
Good afternoon, we absolutely love your venue.
Well thank you! Good afternoon to you as well. How can I help? – those are the words swirling now in the brains of the venue owners
I was there last weekend to see “Phil Lenz and the Road Warriors”, man they rocked and the sound was amazing.
Wow, this band is invested into seeing others and they took the time to come to our venue! They even recognized the hard work we put into our sound!
I think our band would be a great fit for your venue.
They came to see our venue.. check. They support others in the music area…check. Hmm.. I believe them and want to help them.
You can check out videos of us here.
I didn’t even have to search to try and find them! The fact they took the time to produce a great video let’s me know they also are committed to being professional.
We would love to see if it’s feasible to see if we can play at your venue.
Absolutely! I hope we can work together to create an amazing night which will benefit your band! Let’s work together. I hope our venue can make this work!
Thanks for your time!
My pleasure, I appreciate you reaching out.
Of course, I tried to create some polarization but i think it was important to get the point across. Truth is, if Band 1 would simply start with what Band 2 started with, the opportunity could still exist but it’s likely most venues would just hit delete or dismiss and move on to the next band who is looking for an opportunity.
Also, it’s important to note that it’s also a 2 way street with venues. Not all venues understand the relationship and what asset a band brings. One of the quick tips up front was visiting the venue, this is not just to scope out the size but to scope out the operations and maybe just ask the band of their experience of the venue from their perspective. This article was written as a perspective from a venue owner (myself) and where I could see opportunity to craft the pitch (as a musician). However, don’t sell yourself short either and make sure the venue is an asset and not a liability for your band. It’s no fun to play with an owner that doesn’t respect what you bring to the table and sees you simply as a pawn. It can also hurt your brand playing a place that doesn’t market or work to get crowds (regardless as much as you wanted that money or “don’t care because you are getting paid”). For me, I look at long term investments with venues and will gladly take a reduction up front if it’s building opportunity and will pay consistent dividends down the road.
I end with these thoughts:
- Success comes to those who communicate and partner with others without attitude. Teamwork makes the dream work.
- Bands / Venues typically want the same thing. Work to make it feasible so you get to play, make some spending cash, and do what you love
- Don’t forget why you even play music. Don’t let pride or money prevent you from experiencing an opportunity which could pay other dividends
- Be a part of the music community and support others!
Thanks for reading this. I’ve got a whole bunch of other things I’d like to share soon. Rock on and be good to each other.
Pro Tip #27: Where is everybody?
by Ken Kirkland
It happens more often than you might think. Especially when you’re playing at a new venue. Maybe they had booked a different band that cancelled at the last second and you’re filling in. Maybe you’re playing on a Monday, or the venue down the street has a huge sold-out show. Or the venue forgot you were coming, or…or…or…
Every nightmare scenario you can think of can actually happen. Sometimes when I’m talking with someone I’ll get the question: “What’s your one piece of advice for musicians just starting out?”
It’s a legit question. Usually I’ve spouted out some kind of “Do it because you love it” or “Just don’t quit” type of responses, which are kinda lame. Now I finally feel like I have a legit answer. What’s my piece of advice for musicians starting out?
“Learn how to play to an empty room.”
You are probably thinking, “Damn, Ken. That’s the most depressing shit I’ve ever heard.” But wait, there is a real art to it. Not just the performance itself, but the mindset you need before, during, and after a gig like that. Especially if you end up playing several of them back to back. And yeah, that happens too.
If you’re reading this there’s a pretty good chance you’re familiar with at least one of my bands, MidLife Crisis or Giants Among Men. You should know that we work hard to perfect our music and try to blow peoples minds when we play. But we have played to empty rooms. Lots of them. We have played rooms where no one has clapped. You know what? Once, we actually played to a huge room where we had the one lone slow-clapper in the back. Like you see in the movies. Clap…clap…clap…clap. That ACTUALLY happened. I actually turned to my bandmate right when it happened and asked, “Did that seriously just happen?”
I admit, after I got back home that night I was devastated. It is difficult to put out that much energy on stage and have zero response to it. To have the one fan walk out during your set to have a cigarette and leave you there alone with no one but the bartenders, band wives, and your bandmates. If you’re like me, your head might start going in a downward spiral. “They don’t care, why should I care?” “Maybe I suck and I don’t know it.” You’re on stage, you’re pissed off, maybe you start to get a little depressed, so you start to play all half-assed.
Stop that. You stop that shit right now. You know why? Because you’re better than that. Because you decided to go out and do this because music makes you happy, so if the room is empty, you play for yourself because you love these freaking songs. (If you don’t love your songs, then play better freaking songs.) Play some covers you love. Go to your freaking happy place. Look at your bandmates. You like them too. You love playing together. This night is for you guys. A chance to sit back with good sound and a cool light show with no pressure other than to just rock out, have a blast, and maybe get a few free beers. Crack jokes. Talk to the two people out there. Ask them questions. Dedicate every song to them. Have conversations with them between songs from up on stage. Laugh! It’s a funny situation! Have a shot of whiskey and play because you love the tone of your bass. Or your guitar. Or whatever. You love to play, so PLAY dammit!
Because someone IS watching. Maybe it is just the sound guy. Maybe it’s the bartender. Maybe it’s your bandmate. But someone is watching you. You can either be cool with everyone and have a blast or act all pissed off and play a crappy show. I’ve seen it. I’ve been there. I’ve seen bands up on stage pissed off and not giving a shit. And you know what? It’s an instant turn off. Now even if I like the songs, I think, “Wow, those guys are assholes. Look at that dude’s face. He’s so pissed off.” That does not make me want to come and talk to you and it does not make me want to tell my friends about you.
I cannot tell you how many times we have played in front of three or four people who have then told us how special they felt and what an amazing night it was for them. How unexpected it was. How much fun they had. In some cases they’ve turned into our most active fans. In other cases that bartender went to bat for us and the next time we played that venue it was a kick-ass show that pulled a ton of people. In yet another case, that sound guy was so excited that they suggested to all their friends that they follow us on Facebook. Or stayed in touch with us so they could do our sound again at another venue.
Learn to play to an empty room. And play amazingly (if that’s actually a word). You will be happy to have learned that skill. Because there is only one thing harder than playing to an empty room, playing to a packed one. But that’s another conversation all together.
Pro Tip #26: WHICH PICK DO YOU PICK?
by Sam Wilder
With all the money we spend on guitars, effects, amps, and more guitars it’s hard to imagine how a little piece of plastic that costs almost nothing can make such a noticeable difference in your playing. And up until right now you probably didn’t even realized it. But the truth is your pick is the bridge between you and your guitar. It’s an extension of your fingers and what’s more important than that?
When you first start playing it’s different because at that point who really cares. But after a few months or years of practice you may come to find that a simple pick change can improve or at least alter your playing literally overnight. So for today’s Pro Tip we will compare the various pick options and hopefully you’ll find one better suited to you than the one you’re using now.
The playability and tone of a particular pick basically depends on 5 factors. Thickness, hardness, texture, size/shape and material.
1. Thickness
Guitar picks come in 1 of 4 general gauges. Thin, medium, heavy and extra heavy with the actual thickness/mm of the gauges varying. Depending on the manufacturer these ranges can vary considerably. But don’t worry about the exact numbers just yet. Let’s start first by comparing thin vs thick.
Thin picks are typically better for brighter tones (because their striking surface accentuates high frequencies), tighter dynamic range (because their flexibility limits the volume that can be achieved, which works especially well for recording) and acoustic guitar strumming (partly because of the tighter dynamic range but also because it adds more clarity to the individual notes in the chord).
Thick picks are typically better for mellower tones (because the weight and rounder edges emphasize more bass and less treble), a wider dynamic range (because they offer greater control over volume and attack), electric lead guitar (because they allow for more speed and accuracy during fast solos) and heavy distorted sounds (because they offer more clarity and separation between note. And even if heavier picks happen to suit your style of play, the downside is that they require more finger strength and dexterity to control. So consider that as well when choosing your gauge.
2. Hardness
Even if a particular pick is on the thinner side, if it’s made from a HARDER material you’ll find that the added stiffness offers performance characteristics resembling that of thicker picks and vice versa. Thick but softer picks typically have performance qualities closer to that of most thinner picks. Make sense?
3. Texture
The more textured the surface of the pick the more friction will exist between the pick and your fingers and the easier it will be to grip. Especially when you’re sweaty. The same goes for softer picks. For the most part more grip is a good thing for everyone. But there MAY or MAY NOT be a trade off because texture also affects how the pick rolls off the strings. Smooth slippery picks produce cleaner, natural tone and rough picks will add more grit and color to the tone. Smooth round edges will have a warmer, more purer tone, while sharp edges will have a stronger attack and brighter sound.
4. Size and Shape
With smaller picks there’s less distance between your hands and the strings making it easier to use different hand techniques like palm muting and fingerpicking. Of course “small” is a totally relative term depending on the size of your hands. Perhaps the best advice is to find a pick big enough to fit your hands… but NO bigger.
Now, moving on to shape. You can find all kinds or weird pick shapes if you look hard enough (sharkfin picks being the most famous example) but in almost all cases you are better off sticking to a common, standard triangular teardrop shape.
5. Materials
The final and most important factor of all.
The material of the pick is what ultimately determines the stiffness, texture, and overall performance so let’s check out our options.
Throughout history, musicians have tried making picks out of almost everything imaginable and the best material of all came from the shell of the Atlantic Hawksbill Turtle and was known simply as “tortoiseshell“. Starting in the early 1900’s plastic picks designed to emulate tortoiseshell slowly gained in popularity up until the early 70’s when the Atlantic Hawksbill became endangered and plastics took over entirely. The 3 most popular plastics are nylon (which is typically softer with a textured grip, and is best suited for lightweight flexible picks), celluloid (which is stiffer with a smoother slicker texture compared to nylon) and acetal (aka Tortex, Dunlop’s popular line which has a textured grittiness that closely mimics the feel of tortoiseshell).
Now finally, what picks do I recommend? I don’t. I’m a bass player lol! No seriously, I’d love to give you a straight answer but as I’m sure you know you can only learn so much from pure information and you can’t know for sure which pick you’ll pick until you try picking with them all. Since picks are practically free anyway just buy assortment pack of different gauges and different materials. Try them out at home on your own time. That way you can take as long as you need to figure out what you like and what you don’t.
So there you go. Hopefully this post has answered all your questions and helped you find the perfect pick for whatever style music you play!
Pro Tip #25: How to be the douchy band nobody wants to play a gig with.
By Sam Wilder
My band, the G.O.A.M.F.T. is, well, the greatest band of all MF time. We’re so awesome, in fact, that bands on the same bill as us never ask my group to play another show with them because they know they just can’t keep up. We just end up embarrassing them with our insanely badass songs and wild, passionate stage presence. If you want to get on our level (which honestly is impossible) here are some tips that will transform you into the band nobody wants to play with ever again.
1. Never Do Your Own Promotion
Most promoters who book G.O.A.M.F.T want us to spend weeks advertising the show online, inviting people, and doing all sorts of other lame BS. Why should musicians have to promote? I’m not a promoter. I’m the lead singer and lead guitarist of the sickest band in America right now, bro! If the venue can’t figure out a way to get people in the door, that’s on them! Musicians are musicians, and that’s all you need to succeed. Venues and bookers will ask us not to play shows in the area for a few weeks before the show, and we say we won’t. But here’s a little secret, we always do. They say it’s important to make sure to get the best crowd. They’re just looking after themselves. They can’t tell us what to do. Who cares if the other bands asked you to do the same? You have to get your music out there. Your band is way more important than any one gig, so you don’t really need to keep your word when bands ask you to block out a date. The real music fans out there, and the truly cool venues in biggest cities, don’t care about how many people you draw, it’s all about the music. Besides, caring about draw makes you a sellout.
2. Don’t Coordinate Marketing Efforts with Other Bands
I don’t want to have to reach out to the other bands either. What could I possibly talk to them about? Sure, we could share each other’s music over our respective social media accounts so the fans will be excited about the whole bill, and coordinating posts can be helpful, but that’s nerd stuff. My social followers only care about us, not someone else. I’m an artist anyway. I’m just above all that.
3. Load In Last Minute
Most venues will have a load-in time (a time when the lesser bands drop off their gear backstage and do their soundcheck). If your band is half as amazing as G.O.A.M.F.T the other bands probably aren’t going to mind if you load in after the show starts. They know they’re only there to warm up the crowd. We’re the main attraction. When the G.O.A.M.F.T set up, we take our sweet ass time. We have a very specific sound, and it takes time to dial it in. We don’t really think about the audience or the other bands when we’re doing this. When we’re onstage, it’s our stage.
4. Skip Soundcheck
The problem with soundcheck is that soundchecking is boring! Why should I have to show up hours before the show even starts? We just do ours before our set. Sure, it might interrupt the flow of the show, but it’s a small price to pay to see the G.O.A.M.F.T. Soundchecks are for chumps.
5. Miss the Other Bands’ Sets
First off, let me say that you’re under no obligation to watch the other bands. I’m sorry that I don’t want to watch your weak band. I didn’t agree to watch anyone, and I’m on a tour with new support acts every night. How could I possibly have enough interest in them all? I do, however, expect you to watch my band. You guys could learn a lot, and I’ll be upset if I don’t see you cheering for us in the crowd.
6. Drink… a Lot
Get drunk. It’s what rock stars do, and if you’re going to play a rock-star set, then it’s probably a great idea to do a bunch of shots while you’re hanging out backstage. I mean, Slash was constantly wasted, and he could really rip it! Your bandmates will understand that if you start making mistakes it’s because of the alcohol, not you, and they’ll be cool with it.
7. Hit on All the Women
If a girl is hanging out with the band, she’s probably just there to sell merch or is someone’s girlfriend. There’s really no need to talk to her unless you want to hit on her, which is why she’s really there. And if that woman is in the band, even if she’s the lead singer, she probably isn’t the band leader or the person who does the booking. Women aren’t real musicians anyway.
8. Ignore Sound Engineers
The people who run sound at shows are just musician wannabes. They don’t know what you want or need. Sure, they may get a clearer representation of what the audience is hearing, but they’re dumb, and you don’t need to listen to them. If they give you an attitude, don’t be afraid to get confrontational. They have no power, and you’ll probably never see them again. I’ve been told many so times that my 100-watt Marshall stack is “way too loud for this venue.” You wanna know what that makes me think? That if you don’t like a tinnitus-inducing rock show, you shouldn’t have come to see the G.O.A.M.F.T. Your show should be as loud as you can possibly make it. If your amp sounds good in your practice space, it’ll sound good anywhere!
9. Forget Your Filter Onstage
What I love to do onstage is tease the other bands a bit and point out what I didn’t like about their sets. It’s good for them because it shows them how they need to improve. It’s all in good fun, and they always understand. It’s a win-win because it not only improves their act, but it also makes us look great to the audience. If someone in your band (it’s always the bass player) messes up his or her part, feel free to yell at him or her onstage. If you don’t call that person out, how is he gonna learn, right?
10. Don’t Tip the Bartender
Everyone knows you’re a struggling musician, so if you decide you don’t want to tip your bartenders, I’m sure they’ll understand. They got to see your band for free, so they kind of owe you when you really think about it.
Alright, that’s all the knowledge I’m going to let you in on for now. You do all these things, and you won’t even need to practice to become an enormous international megastar. Oh, and you’re welcome